Together with members of your group and students in other sections, you’ll be reading The Purple Hibiscus over the next several weeks. Although you're not required to take notes while you read, it would be wise to keep track of important events and characters for your own clarification. You are, however, expected to participate regularly and thoughtfully in an online discussion of seven essential questions.
Here's how it works:
Divide your book into two roughly equal halves. You need to have read and blogged about your book by the due dates below.
- There are two kinds of posts in this discussion: comments and responses.
- Post at least SIX comments altogether: at least THREE for the 1st half of reading and at least THREE for the 2nd half.
- You must comment on at least five essential questions over the course of your reading.
- You may comment on only two questions more than once.
- One of your six comments can be a "free response" post.
- Post at at least TEN responses altogether: at least FIVE for the 1st half of reading and at least FIVE for the 2nd half.
- In addition, you will post at least ONE comment and ONE response to the question about Veils, the Portland Stage Company production on March 6. [Note: If you do not attend this production, you will need to post an additional comment and response to the book questions.]
Due dates:
- Post your first three comments and five responses by FRIDAY, FEB. 28.
- Post your final three comments and five responses by TBA (date to be announced in class).
- Post your comment & response about the play by MONDAY, MARCH 10.
- How do the characters assert their individuality within a repressive society?
- Where do the characters find sources of inspiration in their lives?
- How are the characters affected by events/changes in society?
- How is the practice of veiling (or restrictions on dress in general) reflective of cultural attitudes toward gender roles? How do these attitudes affect characters’ lives?
- How does our cultural background shape our perception of women and the practice of veiling (or wearing a head scarf) in other countries?
- How do the characters’ personal stories expand your understanding of the societies in which they live?
- Should there be one standard for gender equality throughout the world? Why or why not?
Essential Question for Veils: (play by Tom Coash at Portland Stage Company)
The main point of contention between Intisar and Samar in the play is their differing opinions on
the practice of veiling. Which character makes the more compelling argument, in your opinion?
Why?
Assessment: To earn maximum credit, post thoughtful responses that are at least a short paragraph in length—and carefully proofread! Do not misspell characters' or authors’ names! Also, be sure to include specific references to the text (either details or short quotations).
1. The way that Kambili and Jaja act in a society that is oppressive is through obeying their parents. They are obedient to the point of feeling like an opposing view is betrayal toward their parents. They often keep to themselves, and try their best to avoid conflict, in a country where coups and rebellion are the ways Nigeria has come to be what it is. When there are Demonstrations to protest the rights of citizens, the family does not take part, they will be found at home, spending time as a family, which is what makes them very different from many of the people they are surrounded by.
ReplyDeleteTheir obedience is astonishing. It surprises me that they have not become rebellious at all since they are both teenagers, but there are some indications that Jaja could start to become rebellious. This is shown at the beginning of the book when Jaja talked back at his father which made him throw an object and break figurines on a shelf. I wonder if this attitude will increase throughout the book.
DeleteI agree Torri, I feel like Kamnili is more afraid to rebel against her father, maybe due to the fact she is a girl. Jaja definitely resents his fathers fanatic with God and is more vocal about it. When they go to their grandfathers for 15 minutes Jaja tells his grandfather that he will drink his soft drinks even if their father thinks they are "food sacrificed to idols". Jaja also doesn't care that they came home late from the trip even though his father told them only 10 minutes.
DeleteI too agree with Torri. After the first chapter, I didn't expect Jaja and Kambili to be as obedient to their father as they are.
DeleteI agree with Torri as well. They both are not rebellious at all, and are just being themselves, which is just how they have always been raised to be.
DeleteAfter finishing the book I realize more how obedient Jaja and Kambili are. I think that if Jaja had acted out like he did at the end of the book towards the beginning of the book, Eugene would've reacted very differently.
DeleteMany times while reading this book, I thought to myself, "Why don't they just rebel somehow? I'm sure their mother would take their side." But then I realised that I actually have no idea how they feel about their lives. I thought that the idea of rebelling probably didn't even cross their minds, they were so oppressed by their father.
DeleteI think that Kambili didn't rebel partially because she was a girl, but mostly, because she didn't really know how to or where to begin. Rebelling against her oppressive parents was never an option or even an idea in her mind. I think because Jaja was a teenage boy, his rebellion was more likely to happen sooner or later and more easy to ensue for himself. The oppression by their father totally took over their lives.
Delete2. First and foremost, the inspiration for the entire family is god. Everything they do in their daily lives is connected to pursuing god’s will. They say prayers after every meal, they go to Catholic Mass each and every Sunday. Eugene, the father, feels as though he has no credit for what he has accomplished in his life, god is to thank for all that he has achieved. For both Jaja, and Kambili, their father is an inspirational figure. The children are expected to be at the top of their class each and every term, and if they are not, there will be consequences. Their father wants them to have a better life than he had growing up, and he feels the best way to do that is through a strong educational background as children.
ReplyDeleteI agree completely with your statement, but I feel that the main character Kambili and her brother Jaja are striving for their father's praise that isn't given often. Jaja's love for God comes off less strong than it should be in his father's eyes, but to me it just seems like he doesn't want his father to be angry with him. The same goes for Kambili, but she doesn't betray her religion as Jaja did so far in the book.
DeleteI agree with Torri that the children do not have as much belief as their father. They say things like "Praise be to God" or "It is in His hands" to please their father, not because they actually believe in it.
DeleteTheir relationship to their father actually reminded me of Jane's relationship with her aunt in "Jane Eyre." They would hate him in certain moments—generally when he was abusing them in the name of religion—but other times, they would seem very intent on pleasing him, for reasons which may not be apparent to the modern American reader. Many points in the book, if read out of context, would indicate that the father is a benevolent and loving parent, while other moments show him to be a complete tyrant.
DeleteI agree with Torri. Eugene's family was obviously influenced by God primarily and saw Him as an inspiration, but kambili and Jaja, Kambili more so, also saw their father as an inspiration. Whenever Jaja would say something that in return got their father's approval or a positive head nod, Kambili would rage with jealousy wishing she could have pleased him first. They are both striving to be seen as good in their father's eyes and also in God's.
Delete7. I absolutely believe that equality should be a principle in all societies, and many others feel the same. Whether or not equality will ever be a standard is still to be seen. In a place as traditional as Nigeria, I believe it will be some time until women and men are at the same level. Most of Africa and the Middle East views a woman as being inferior to a man. Though many countries around the world are taking a step in the right direction, Nigeria is not taking that step at the moment, but very well could in the not so distant future.
ReplyDeleteThis equality imbalance can be demonstrated when Papa beats his wife, daughter, and son with a leather belt for breaking the Eucharist fast. In America this would be totally unspeakable. Law enforcement would probably be involved if word got out that a husband would do that to his own family for such a small issue to non religious people. Mama in the book almost never speaks out against Papa, she just goes with whatever he says submissively.
DeleteEquality is based on culture. We may believe that equality is a necessary part of life in society and that our viewpoint is right, but someone in Nigeria may believe that equality should not and cannot exist and believe our position is wrong and horrible. Although equality is something that should exist in all countries, it will be very difficult to achieve it because all countries, cultures, beliefs and standards are different and reaching common ground is a struggle.
DeleteI agree with you Ali. As much as I would like to think equality between genders could be world wide, I don't see it happening anytime soon. We think of it more as a moral issue, that everyone is obliged to the same rights as other people. In other countries, especially ours, both genders receive the same rights and freedoms so it is what we are used to seeing and expect in other cultures. With that said, there are still some issues regarding women feeling inferior to men even in the US. In other countries religion dominates. If people in other countries interpret their religion showing a inferior and superior relationship between genders then that is how it is. It would be hard to conform such diverse, stubborn cultures.
Delete4. Our cultural background shapes the perception we have on women and how they live in other countries. In our modern American culture, we see women as perfectly equal to men, and give most, if not all, the same opportunities to both. We do not “require” women to be covered all the time, making the practice of wearing a veil seem strange and even oppressive at times. Also, by seeing only a few images of other countries, the false idea that all women wear a head scarf in some areas becomes imbedded in the culture of the country, completely affecting our perception of other ways of life.
ReplyDeleteAmericans do not realize how free they are, whether it be with the government, clothing choices, school, or even how we treat our parents at home. In the book everything action from Kambili's family is so precise and they try to follow every rule. In my family, we can wear mostly whatever we want but Kambili almost never wore trousers and only wore dresses and skirts. Also they thank their mother, father, and God after every meal. They treat their parents with more respect than I've ever heard of before. Nigerian culture is no doubt more oppressive than American culture.
DeleteAs Americans, we assume a lot about other countries. We tend to assume other countries have the same freedoms as us, when in reality, other countries are so much different. Their cultures and standards are different, and we do not alway realize this. This causes us to be in utter shock when we read about or see something in a country that is different than us. Our background causes our view point to be construed.
DeleteJack, I think we actually are exposed to a lot of different cultures around the world. People are definitely aware of how women are portrayed in different cultures and countries. I do agree there are stereotypes about what these women look like though.
Delete6. The personal stories of the characters in Purple Hibiscus, especially Kambili, expands the understanding I have of the African society. As I only know a small bit about Nigeria, I was under the impression that it is a Muslim nation, with only a few remote areas of Christians or other religions. Also, from Kambili’s family being able to go on vacations and have money expanded my knowledge, as like most Americans, I did not know that these societies do in fact have some very wealthy families, who are able to send children to large private schools.
ReplyDeleteI didn't know much about Nigerian society either, I am somewhat surprised to so far not find any references to anything Muslim yet. The characters in the book have either been Christian or Pagan. Also, usually families that are in the middle eastern countries that are not wealthy are heard from in the news instead of wealthier families who aren't struggling. It is important to hear from both sides of the wealth.
DeleteYeah, most people associate Africa with poor people, when it turns out there are wealthy people there too. Like Torri said, it is important to see both sides of the story. It is also very interesting to see both sides.
DeleteHonestly, at the risk of sounding like an uneducated American teenager, I was unaware at how close to our own society theirs is, with the exception of the strong religious undertones which we lack.
DeleteIf feel exactly the same way Nathaniel, and I also assumed the family would be poor. Most stories I've heard about people from Africa usually involves a class struggle, but this story was very similar to our own culture. Learning both sides of the story to other cultures before we judge them is a lesson this book has taught me.
DeleteI had no idea that much of Nigeria was Catholic. Nor that some Nigerians such as the characters in this book were well off. Reading the story of Kambili opened by eyes to look past the assumptions I made of countries such as this.
Delete4. Our cultural background shapes the perception we have on women and how they live in other countries. In our modern American culture, we see women as perfectly equal to men, and give most, if not all, the same opportunities to both. We do not “require” women to be covered all the time, making the practice of wearing a veil seem strange and even oppressive at times. Also, by seeing only a few images of other countries, the false idea that all women wear a head scarf in some areas becomes imbedded in the culture of the country, completely affecting our perception of other ways of life.
ReplyDeleteI think what your saying is completely true. I think that no matter how accepting we think we are, we all see other cultures as strange sometimes, and the only way to get used to it is to experience certain parts of other cultures yourself.
DeleteDespite America being totally free and having equality I feel like we don't completely. Often, we see our culture as a much more free compared to that of a country such as Nigeria. Although we see it that way because of our background, it's not entirely true. In America, girls often are shamed for wearing revealing clothing, just like in these other cultures. Although our background causes us to assume a huge difference in cultures from our country to others, there really isn't a huge difference between some and ours.
DeleteThe characters in Kambili's family don't have many distinguishing ways to express individuality in an oppressive society. They just follow their father's lead. So far in the book Kambili doesn't know much else than what her schedule tells her to do, but maybe by hanging out with her much more relaxed cousins they will help her express individuality in a way that is more unique to who Kambili actually is and not what her religion insists that she do or what her father writes for her to do on her schedule.
ReplyDeleteI agree, but she seems to be missing home and dreading being at her cousins house because Amaka makes snide comments whenever Kambili asks a question. I'm sure she will learn to have a little bit of fun, just as soon as the tension between them is gone. Amaka views Kambili as a snotty rich girl who has an easy life, and they have trouble relating.
DeleteLike Evan said, she seems to miss home now, but I think being with her cousins will eventually make her more individual and independent.
DeleteIt was interesting while reading the second half of the book to watch Kambili slowly become more independent and free as a person. Hudson, you ended up guessing right about her cousins and aunt becoming the biggest factor in this change of mindset and independence.
DeleteThe characters are affected by religious events in society in a major way because of the cultural divide between religions. It is expected that Kambili and Jaja follow through with the exact expectations of their religion, and if they don't their Papa throws a fit. Also when they went to a pagan event in society that wasn't of their religion and this affected them in a negative way because their father became furious.
ReplyDeleteHm I wasn't thinking of religious events, but this does make sense. Political issues don't affect the characters, but the personal religious ones do.
DeleteShould there be one standard for gender equality throughout the world? Why or why not?
ReplyDeleteThere should be one standard for gender equality because the societies where women are treated lesser than their male counterparts are being held back from the country's full potential. Without letting women do men's work, they have to rely completely on a man to do work that a woman could also easily do. In America, there are amazing women that compete with men regularly on a high level of work. Women like Hillary Clinton or Oprah. If American women can do this, so can Nigerian women. Maybe their governments would be more balanced if they let talented smart women achieve things like men.
I agree that culture and the stubborn views of those perceiving the religion couldn't be changed fast, but shouldn't it have made some progress by now? Although it would be hard, we should be able to convince/prove other countries the importance of gender equality.
DeleteHow do the characters assert their individuality within a repressive society? Not very many of the characters assert their individuality. The only ones who really do out Aunt Ifeoma and her children. They are not afraid to speak their minds, even to Eugene, which astonishes Kambili. They assert themselves also by disobeying Eugene by letting Kambili and Jaja do pagan things and going against their mostly catholic surroundings.
ReplyDeleteI agree, Aunt Ifeoma asserts her individuality so much, it kind of shocks Kambili. Hopefully, it will make Kambili more independent herself.
DeleteWhere do the characters find sources of inspiration in their lives? The characters find inspiration from God. Kambili's family is centered around that. Everything they do is through or by faith. Other characters, such as Ade, find inspiration in future freedom, as does Ifeoma.
ReplyDeleteHow does your cultural background shape our perception of women and the practice of veiling?
ReplyDeleteOur cultural background shapes are perception immensely. We expect other countries to have similar freedoms, so when we realize that women have to cover themselves because that is what society expects, it is so strange to us. Our culture affects how we see this because we are so different.
Exactly. I've figured that the American view is that if another country is not as industrialized/accepting then it is oppressive and torturous, so anything different than what we normally see is set as something "oppressive".
Delete2. Where do the characters find sources of inspiration in their lives?
ReplyDeleteThe father finds his inspiration in God. He finds his inspiration in God and expects his family to find inspiration there as well. Kambili and Jaja are very dependent on the approval of their father, and I think they find inspiration in pleasing him. I believe Kambili is more dependent on this than Jaja. The mother finds inspiration in her children, and in helping other people. She helps her children and does things just to be kind. I think this gives her peace of mind.
I think all of this is very true. I also think Eugene and Kambili find inspiration in organization as well. Eugene organizes every one's lives and I think this makes things easy for Kambili. All she knows is this organization and by following her schedule she pleases her father. Her father is her inspiration.
Delete7. Should there be one standard for gender equality throughout the world? Why or why not?
ReplyDeleteI don't think that there could ever be one standard for gender equality, nor should there be. There are so many different cultures that it doesn't make sense to have one standard for equality because not all cultures are the same.
You're right. To change the standard of inequality, you would really have to change the culture. Equality standards are based completely off of their cultures' histories, you cannot change one standard of a societies culture without affecting the culture itself.
DeleteIt's sad that there has to be a "standard of inequality". All cultures and religion should promote men and women having equal opportunities and equal roles. Religion often has a lot to do with tradition but this is a tradition that should be stopped.
Delete1. How do the characters assert their individuality within a repressive society?
ReplyDeleteI do not think that many of the characters really assert their individuality. The only character who really shows individuality is Aunt Ifeoma. She is a very assertive woman and she doesn't tolerate Eugene telling her what to do.
Aunt Ifeoma's children show their individuality as well. You see how different they really are when they interact with Kambili and Jaja. It shows how repressed they really are by their father where as Aunt Ifeoma's children are not repressed by her.
DeleteI agree with you. The characters seem to just kind of go with how they have lived for all these years, and just let change come and go, staying the way they always have been.
DeleteWhere do the characters find sources of inspiration in their lives? - Religion and God is a huge inspiration to all characters in the book so far, especially in Eugene's family. Kambili and Jajas lives revolve around their religion. They are enveloped and repressed because of it. Before and after each meal their father preaches and expects the family to bless something in the name of god as well. Even in the car Eugene expects his family to recite each decade of the rosary. I did not enjoy the first part of the book because I thought it was a boring diary. It mostly described the rituals of Kambili's life. As I continued to read I realized that the first parts of the book is a important factor to help you understand how God is present in their life 24/7. I think religion should help guide in the decisions you make but never rule your choices. When the author describes the hibiscuses in the beginning of the book I thought they sort of represented the culture and religion. Everyone stopped by to pick the flowers, no matter your job or place in society. That to me represented how religion and God is a common interest and present in everyones life.
ReplyDeleteHow do the characters assert their individuality within a repressive society? - I don't really see much individuality in Eugene's family. Kambili and Jaja are held to specific standard by their father to live their life his way. They are expected to do perfect in school and follow all religious guidelines. Both kids cannot express their uniqueness through clothes because they are forced to wear uniforms which their father also approves of. To the other students in the school Kambili and Jaja are seen as privileged and Kambili is assumed to be stuck up when really she is just shy and hasn't even figured out who she is because of her fathers over bearing rules. Individuality is present in their aunt and her family. Kambili's aunt is a university teacher. She makes sure she runs her own life. Whenever Aunt Infeoma is in a chapter the word laughter follows. She makes sure to get everything beautiful out of life, no suppressing it. "Mama's bare lips were pale compared to Aunty Ifeoma's, covered in a shiny bronze lipstick." (page 50) This to me was a small representation of Kambilis Aunt showing more individuality than their mother was allowed. In the beginning Kambilis mother did have small figurines that had meaning to her. They represented a piece of her but shattered just like her individual opinions and thoughts are kept secret from their father.
ReplyDeleteI definitely agree that Aunty Ifeoma's makeup shows how she expresses her individuality more than Kambili's family is allowed to. It shows how Mama is controlled by Papa, because she is not allowed to use makeup.
DeleteI can't even imagine what it Would have actually been like for Kambili, Jaja, and their mother. They were never allowed to figure out who they were and then they see their aunt, and cousins and they see kids at school who express themselves, and are able to speak out. It would have been so frustrating knowing exactly what you want to say but not being able to say it, and feeling like you did something wrong because you thought against the wishes of your father.
Delete3. It seems like the characters are not affected that much by events and changes in society. Early on in the book, there is a military coup d’etat and a new government takes over Nigeria, but Kambili’s family goes about life normally. It doesn’t really change their daily life that much. The only events that come about from the new government are Ade Coker’s arrest and the movement of the publication of The Standard newspaper (that Papa owns and Coker edits) to a secret location, although those do not affect Kambili very much.
ReplyDeleteI agree here. It appears that to them, life isn't really affected by the changes in the nation, much like the day-to-day life in America during times of issue or economic falling (the current crisis). While small things change for them, it isn't too much a problem for them with the change in society.
DeleteI agree with you both that they don't seem affected by the events in the world around them, at least not until the end.
DeleteI believe that the coups in the country do affect the characters. Since Eugene has that newspaper, his family is a target by the government. Once Ade is killed, Eugene's family is more on edge that the same may happen to him, especially when they are more frequently stopped on the road and military members come visit them. So these government military events do affect the characters.
Delete6. All of the characters’ personal stories help with understanding their society. Kambili and Jaja’s family are so rich that they have so many things that they do not use and they take for granted. At the same time, Aunty Ifeoma and her family lack many things that Kambili might consider basic. This shows the class divide in their society. Eugene’s story also shows the relationship and role of Christian and Pagan religions. The Christian missionaries came in and made Christianity the dominant religion, and now Catholics like Eugene do not like Pagans like Papa-Nnukwu.
ReplyDeleteInteresting. The family can afford more than the average citizen, showing that even in Nigeria, there is still those richer than others. Also, the idea that there are people who live simply as well as generously reflect how even American culture/classes are in everyday life.
Delete2. The characters all get inspiration from different places. Eugene (Papa) gets inspiration from God. He is very religious and very strict about it. Jaja and Kambili get inspiration from their father, or more specifically, pleasing their father. Papa is strict and sometimes violent, occasionally whipping his family with his belt. Therefore, they do not necessarily look up to him, but everything they do is trying to please him. Kambili works really hard at school to become top of the class, because otherwise, her father will be very mad.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteExactly. While they have all seeked inspiration from God, they all have other motives inspiring themselves, which is actually how they show individuality.
Delete1.How does our cultural background shape our perception of women and the practice of veiling (or wearing a head scarf) in other countries?
ReplyDeleteOur cultural background has a large influence on our perception of women and the practice of veiling in other countries. The way people are brought will be connected with what they think about the act of veiling. Not being accustomed to seeing this may appear as strange when we see this. Without the normal freedoms and liberties that we have, gives a very different environment for people in other areas of the world.
I feel like when we look at other cultures we sometimes think that the people are being oppressed because we are so used to having a lot of freedom and equality.
Delete2. Where do the characters find sources of inspiration in their lives?
ReplyDeleteThe characters find all of their sources of inspiration from God. Through their day they were always looking to do everything they can for god. Their father leads the way with his devotion to god and then he looks to find that the rest of his family are being equally devoted. Kambili and Jaja both work very hard to please their father. With the expectations from their father, they have most of what the do planned out, and the plans are to show their devotion. Kambili and Jaja almost have more inspiration for pleasing their father than the do actually taking part in devotion to god. They also work very hard in the classroom to make sure they are among the top of the classWith lesser expectations from their father, Kambili and Jaja may have lesser expectations.
I agree that Kambili and Jaja work more to please their father than actually believing in God.
Delete3.Should there be one standard for gender equality throughout the world? Why or why not?
ReplyDeleteThere should be one standard for gender equality throughout the world. There should be one because with limitations on some people in a country, you limit the potential of some people. With not having equality in some countries, people who could have a lot to offer, are getting killed. With gender equality in our country, we have had very influential and important people for both male and female. People should both have the opportunity to create things and do what they want. However, the chances of this ever happening are very small because the different cultures and religions don't all believe this. People have such stubborn views that they will most likely not be willing to change soon.
Which character makes the more compelling argument, in your opinion? Why?
ReplyDeleteI do not think either of the characters made a better argument because they were arguing for the same thing. They both wanted to have the choice to wear a veil. The girl from America wanted the choice to be able to wear the veil and the girl from Egypt wanted the choice to not wear the veil. They both wanted choice.
Very good point. They both want a choice to wear a veil. The American girl wanted a choice to wear a veil, and the Egyptian girl wanted the choice not to wear a veil and not to be forced to wear one.
DeleteIntisar and Samar both make compelling arguments. They both want freedom to choose to wear a veil, or not. If I had to choose, I would say Samar, the Egyptian girl, made a more compelling argument. Intisar argues simply for religious freedom, while Samar has experienced the other side of the story, being oppressed and forced to veil. I think her argument against oppression is slightly more compelling, although both the arguments are very similar, arguing for the freedom to choose whether to veil or not.
ReplyDeleteI partially agree that Samar had more reason to fight the veil because it was more likely that she would be forced to wear one at some point, but I don't think either of them really made a good argument because there really was no argument to be had.
DeleteWhile both characters are able to make their own argument, neither actually makes a compelling one. Both have their opinions of wanting choice, Instair, an American believed she should be able to wear it because of religion, while Samar wanted to simply have the choice to wear a veil or not, using oppression as an example. It boils down to the character's own personal preference, with no real argument actually being "compelling" enough to prove their point.
ReplyDelete3. How are the characters affected by events/changes in society?
ReplyDeleteAt first Kambili's family does not seem to be affected by the events happening around them. They sit and listen to the news on the radio but nothing changes for them. Things start changing towards the end when Ade Coker is killed. The house gets very tense and Kambili is beaten until she has to go to the hospital. It seems that everything that could go wrong goes wrong. Finally Eugene is found dead, poisoned, Jaja takes the fall for his mother and goes to jail. Aunty Ifeoma moves to America with her family and their lives are all changed.
4. How is the practice of veiling (or restrictions on dress in general) reflective of cultural attitudes toward gender roles? How do these attitudes affect characters’ lives?
ReplyDeleteThe practice of veiling was originally about religious beliefs, but in some places it has become more about power than religion. Some countries have made it so women have no choice but to wear a hijab, or a burka. I think that forcing women to wear certain clothing makes women appear to be weak, or below men. The women must be obedient to the man, and they show this by forcing women to wear certain things. This mind set affected Kambili and her mother. They both had to wear skirts all of the time because Eugene said it was sinful for a woman to wear pants, or "a man's clothing". They also had to have their hair completely covered, especially at church or going to any public place. This went further than their dress though. Eugene made sure that both women were completely obedient to him and when they were not he punished them physically.
I agree. The house was like a small country, where all the citizens were oppressed by one ruler, who was too stubborn to realise that he was the one causing the discontent. He assumed that it was everyone's choice to where the "appropriate" clothing, and not his oppressive views forcing them to.
Delete5. How does our cultural background shape our perception of women and the practice of veiling (or wearing a head scarf) in other countries?
ReplyDeleteWomen in American culture are seen as capable, strong, and able to stand up for themselves. Women have the same rights as men and in our culture nobody is forced to wear something they don't want to, and women are seen as equals. When we look at other cultures in which women wear head scarfs, or dress conservatively, we tend to think "oppressed". I think that with our culture being so open and free, we think of other cultures who are not so open as old fashioned, or wrong. Many women in these cultures do not feel this way. They are happy living their lives and I think we should think about other cultures through their perspective not ours.
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ReplyDeleteIn her youth, Intisar could very well have been made to wear the veil, to such an extent that in later years she automatically assumed that it was her own choice. However, I believe she had the more convincing argument, because I find it hard to believe that she enjoys wearing the veil constantly, and yet she insisted that she must to be a good Muslim. Samar's argument made her sound like she just wanted to pick and choose what parts of Islam she was going to agree with. If one is to follow a religion, then they should not be able to choose which parts they agree with. Then they become a "cafeteria religious"—they take the practices they like (i.e., the Call to Prayer) and leave the practices they don't (wearing the veil).
ReplyDeleteOut of the two, I would believe Intisar to be the better Muslim, because she follows all of the practices, even the ones that she might not enjoy.
I see your point, but I do have to disagree with the idea that if one person follows a religion, they must follow all aspects of it. There are plenty of sections in any holy book that could just not work today, and people need to take the books in context, not bringing it to modern day.
DeleteMost of the wealthy characters—Papa, Ade, the local priest—do not show any signs of individuality. They are all basically the same—Christian and self-righteous. I think this is the difference between the rich and the poor of their culture. The rich are all Christian and unable to express themselves, while the poor are either Christian or pagan, and are able to express their individuality.
ReplyDeleteGood point, the wealthy characters are not very individual because they are very Christian, and they just fit into the sort of 'mold' and it controls their life.
DeleteI see what you're getting at, but I think the government wouldn't allow someone of a certain status, like a priest or a journalist, someone who represents a group to be too individual, like in the case of Ade Coker, his inability to "conform" cost him his life. But I do agree that many of the wealthier, more "prestigious" characters were rather insipid.
DeleteInteresting thread of discussion here! So what distinguishes Christian characters like Eugene and Father Amadi and Aunt Ifeoma? They're all faithful Christians. Is is just wealth? It seems to me that Father Amadi and Aunt Ifeoma have found a way to reconcile their Christian faith with their native heritage. Eugene, on the other hand, has rejected his heritage, thereby leaving himself cut off, in a sense, rootless, a slave to dogma.
DeleteFather Amadi, Aunt Ifeoma, and Eugene faithfully follow their Christian beliefs, but Eugene is more set apart from Aunt Ifeoma and Father Amadi. Eugene practices his faith in a very strict fashion, all rules must be followed. Aunt Ifeoma and Father Amadi tend to stay closer to their Nigerian roots by singing in Igbo during prayers. They are more free willed, they take their religion seriously, but they don't treat it as something to worry about all the time like Eugene does.
Delete2. The characters all have different sources of inspiration. The father seems to draw inspiration from religion. The mother draws inspiration from her husband. The children don't seem to have any inspiration in their lives. They should be able to be inspired by their parents, but they cannot, because their father is abusive and their mother has no self-respect.
ReplyDeleteLater, Kambili finds a new role model to draw inspiration from: Father Amadi, the native priest in Nsukka, who took notice of the children in his life, rather than caring only about the adults, in sharp contrast to the European priests from Kambili's home.
Yeah, you're right, Kambili is inspired by Father Amadi later in the book, good point. That is one of the most major plot points in the second half of the book, Kambili's huge crush on him. He is also inspiring to her because he is different from what she is used to, as is all of Nsukka.
DeleteIn my opinion, Father Amadi is one of the most important characters, because he was the main reason for Kambili "coming out of her shell". I think without him, she would still be that same, quiet little girl that she was when she arrived in Nsukka. Even though Amaka and Kambili became closer toward the end of Kambili and Jaja's stay, I still think that Father Amadi was the driving force behind the changes of the whole group.
DeleteI somewhat agree with you Nathaniel, but I think that their mother isn't inspired by their father. Perhaps their father has such a strong emotional hold on their mother is because he supports the family with a stable and high paying job, and also because he is abusive and she is afraid of him. She is afraid of him, but she can't stay away from him because she needs him in order to keep the rich and lavish lifestyle they are living. This could be a reason why she doesn't stand up for her children when they are being punished, she just stands to the side and feels bad for them.
Delete1. The characters do not really assert their individuality much in this society. They simply follow what their father says, and obey. It's not even “repressive”, so much as just following the highly devout-Catholic culture of obeying parent's every command. Kambili and Jaja do use their wealth as a way to show their individuality, as most students at their school do not have as much money as they do. Aunt Infeoma, however, showed some of her own self, contrasting with their mother, who, after her figurines were destroyed, just forgot about them and continued on, as if they were never there.
ReplyDeleteI'll be curious to know if you still feel this way after finishing the book. What's the effect on Kambili and Jaja of living with Aunt Ifeoma and falling for Father Amadi? What's the significance of the purple hibiscus?
DeleteI think that the purple hibiscus's are a sign of starting anew, but also remembering where you come from. The whole idea of "planting the hibiscus plants in America" stems from the idea of experiencing other cultures, but also being familiar with your own.
DeleteYes, Evan, your interpretation makes a lot of sense to me. Also, the notion that the purple hibiscus stands out from all the red ones—that being different while still part of a community is okay, even beautiful and extraordinary.
DeleteThank you for bringing this idea to my attention Evan! I was having trouble realizing the significance of the purple hibiscus so this cleared up my questions wonderfully. Acceptance seems to be a very big message this author was trying to put out. This message can be compared to the play we saw because individuality can and should be expressed without setbacks as long as you are faithful to your religion.
Delete2. The characters find inspiration mainly in God and their religion. More so their father than the children, religion is the answer to every question, and that God will always provide for the people, even if it does not seem like it. However, the children and their mother are inspired by their father. Kambili and Jaja both try their hardest to be the top of the class, to receive approval and admiration from their father, while their mother simply tries to please him in every way she can.
ReplyDeleteI find it interesting how deep the religious influence is. Eugene's father is a pagan, therefore, he worships idols as his pipeline to god. Even though they are worshipping the same god, Eugene still looks down on his father for not converting to Catholicism. His religion is so important to him, that he won't even talk to his own father until he converts. I find that a bit cold.
DeleteThe characters are not affected much by changes in society. Yes, Eugene runs a newspaper that is forced underground, but it does not affect the family too much. Even during the coup in Nigeria, the family just brushes it off as just another change, and their lives aren't affected in any visible sense. It is possible that small, insignificant changes occur to the family structure and daily life, but none of them are enough to warrant a real reaction from any of the characters, much like when government changes in America – it affects everyone, but nobody really notices.
ReplyDelete7. I do believe that there should be a single standard for gender equality worldwide. While this may be harder to obtain in some areas such as the Middle East and certain African nations, it would bring the ideas of equality and the “common good” to places where it is needed the most. However, the ideals of equality that arise for women to men should also be the same for men to women. Unlike some groups, I believe that true equality is equal process in the law, equal ability to have an education, and equal rights in every way. A universal standard for gender equality could be one of human history’s greatest achievements, but not without it’s own issues, as demonstrated in the book itself.
ReplyDeleteits*
DeleteI agree though.
DeleteJack, I completely agree with your statement, though it takes time for a process like this to happen, I think the process is already started. It just seems to be moving very slowly in countries like these, where the traditional values are so strongly upheld.
DeleteI agree with Evan, the process is already started, and we are getting there in the US, but it may take a while for other countries.
DeleteI do agree there should be a single standard but that will be hard to accomplish with so many varying cultures. There has been different standards for women for so long that it will be hard to break "history" or tradition.
Delete3. The father in the story is affected most by the changes in society. Because he runs a major newspaper—the only one willing to print the truth—he is a target for the oppressive government that refuses to allow the truth to be spoken.
ReplyDeleteYeah, true, since the father is involved with the newspaper he is both out in the world and a target.
Delete1. At first, Kambili and Jaja do not assert their individuality much. They just follow what their father says. After they go to Nsukka, they start to assert it more. Jaja asserts his when he refuses to go to communion on Palm Sunday. He refuses to keep following his father. Kambili starts to assert hers when she develops a crush on Father Amadi. Their relationship is very different from her life before of just following her father.
ReplyDeleteI agree with what your saying. It seems as the story progresses, the entire family, not just Kamibili and Jaja, is beginning to go against what Papa is making them believe.
Delete4. The practice of veiling shows how societies treat women. Societies that veil are often male dominated. They try to shield women, protect them from men, and even oppress them. There is not really any veiling in Purple Hibiscus, so that does not affect the characters at all, but the attitudes toward gender roles can be seen in Eugene and Beatrice's (Papa and Mama) relationship; Papa is the oppressive head of the family.
ReplyDeleteI agree Hudson, but also Jaja, a male member of the family, is being oppressed by Eugene. Though Mama and Kambili are getting the most of it, the whole family is being held down, not just the women. Though I also drew the same comparison as well.
DeleteI found it really symbolic when Jaja took the fall for poisoning Papa. It showed a unique sense of unity within the family. The family itself represented the country of Nigeria. It had Jaja, Kambili and Mama, oppressed by Papa, who had very traditional views. Though the three of them, Jaja, Kambili, and Mama, all had somewhat different views, they all came together to fight a "common enemy". The way they unified, I found to be pretty cool.
ReplyDeleteVery interesting analogy. What was happening in the family was kind of like what was happening in the country, with the oppressive head of state.
Delete2. (again) At first, Kambili and Jaja are only inspired by pleasing their father, but after visiting Aunty Ifeoma, and asserting their individuality more, they find other sources of inspiration. Jaja becomes inspired by Ifeoma and her family. He starts to really like it in Nsukka. He is inspired by Ifeoma, Obiora, and Papa-Nnukwu. Kambili becomes inspired by Father Amadi as her crush on him grows, and by Amaka as their friendship grows. Kambili and Jaja seem both to be inspired by Papa-Nnukwu, as shown when they are caught with the painting of him. Papa never let them see him for that long, so when they finally do, they are inspired. They sort of begin to rebel against their father.
ReplyDelete5. I think that our cultural background shapes the way we see all forms of religious dress, not just veiling, though, we see the ritual of veiling differently than the Arab world. We see the act of veiling as a choice, although in many countries like Saudi Arabia, veiling is not a choice, it is a requirement. The government is so traditional that it forces women to abide by traditional Islamic code. Veiling is meant to be a sign of commitment, not a potential sign of oppression.
ReplyDeleteThis is unfortunately very true, some countries can only wish veiling was a choice, as they are forced to wear burkas or cover up. But also, some muslim women make it a personal choice to wear the veil because it shows commitment and makes them feel like part of a huge community of Muslim women just like them.
Delete4. I think the fact that women are forced to wear Burkas in other countries says a lot about gender roles. It shows that in those countries, women are second class citizens, they cannot leave the house without a male escort, and they are hidden from head to toe. To be honest, I think many women chose not to change, because they were very afraid that they would be killed, which is exactly what happened, and still happens when women try to voice their opinions, and rebel in places like the middle east.
ReplyDeleteI agree with this. I think that if women did rebel against it they would get hurt. it's happened before. Some women actually do want to wear the veils for religious purpose but I wonder how many actually want to wear it.
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ReplyDeleteRestrictions of dress do not seem to bother or hinder Kambili or Amaka like it did in the play Veils. Kambili seemed to have to cover up her body much more than Amaka, but this is because Kambili comes from a family where following church and religious expectations comes first. Amaka doesn't have that to worry about, she seems to wear what is fashionable. The only times clothing restrictions are mentioned is when Kambili goes to church. Men don't seem to be limited, but then again how many men want to wear risky styles of clothing? These restrictions doesn't seem to affect gender roles, I think it is just expected that women wear nice things to church.
ReplyDeleteI agree. I think Jaja was the one who rebelled against the school uniforms and wanted freedom to wear what he wanted. I don't think Kambili minded wearing what she was obligated to wear, either that or she never had the guts to speak up.
DeleteWhere do the characters find sources of inspiration in their lives? I can revisit this question after completing the book, and my answer is much different than it was when I started reading the book. Kambili finds inspiration from Father Amadi and how free spirited he was, and she is also very motivated because she has a huge crush on him. Jaja finds inspiration from his cousins and aunt. They all live the life that he wants to live all the time, and he wishes that life upon himself. Their father and mother are still motivated by the same thing, they really haven't evolved as characters throughout this book.
ReplyDeleteHow are the characters affected by events/changes in society? The characters aren't really affected by changes in society until the government's changes get their father's newspaper company messed up. The changes in society are mentioned, but the characters keep living their life as usual. The only time that the changes actually touch Kambili's life is when Ade Coker gets arrested or when something bad happens with The Standard.
ReplyDelete3. How are the characters affected by events/changes in society? During the book, the government is unstable and many people throughout the country are rebelling and speaking out, such as Eugene. Kambili and Jaja are affected by this because it causes them to always worry for their father's, and their own, safety. Despite being richer and of a higher class, they are still a target due to Eugene's newspaper. The event of the Virgin Mary appearing in a certain city is what sparked the changing of their lives. It caused them to be able to visit Auntry Ifeoma, which led them to becoming more individual, outspoken, and to have more widespread views. Lastly, the change in their life of being around their Grandfather affected their lives drastically. Not only did it cause their father to be very upset with them and punish them, but being around him changed how they felt about differing religions such as his. They saw that is wasn't much different from theirs and wasn't as horrible as their father made it out to be. they became more excepting and understanding.
ReplyDelete7. Should there be one standard for gender equality throughout the world? Why or why not? I believe that there should be one standard for gender equality, and that standard should be that all genders are completely equal. I believe this should happen because it would cause so many problems. Mistreatment of certain genders would not happen anywhere, all genders would be respected, no gender would struggle to speak out, and no gender would struggle to live a normal life, let a lone a life at all. (Women in places such as a Afghanistan risk death if they leave their house without a man.) In reality, worldwide equality is almost unattainable. Gender equality standards are often based off of cultural beliefs. To change gender equality standards, you would have to change many societies cultures all together to suit the new standard. Trying to change hundreds of cultures to suit one belief is very unrealistic and not very possible. There should be one set of gender equality standards, but there really can't be.
ReplyDelete4. How is the practice of veiling (or restrictions on dress in general) reflective of cultural attitudes toward gender roles? How do these attitudes affect characters’ lives? Veiling and restriction of dress is always or almost only for women. The idea of veiling or restrictive dress reflects cultural attitudes in the sense that generally women are seen as the lesser gender. In Purple Hibiscus, Kambili, her mother, and other women are expected to obey the men in their life. Dress restrictions were not a big part in the book, but abiding by the rules set by men were. This attitude did affect Aunty Ifeoma, which caused her to tend to rebel against any typical cultural beliefs or inequality. In the novel, cultural dress and attitudes about gender were not a huge focus, but in many countries around the world, they are both a big issues.
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